OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

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kurtdesign1
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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by kurtdesign1 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:25 am

BowhuntnHoosier wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:08 am
I still remember the idea of putting a cigar under running water to improve the burn. Some very different ideas out there. Thanks Kip
This idea is actually rooted in validity, believe it or not. Basically though, it's never something that you or I would ever need to do. For those who truly store cigars long term (decades, not years) they typically adhere to a much lower humidity and temperature than what is generally regarded for good smoking conditions. Soaking or dipping a cigar in water is a way to aggressively moisten the tobacco to bring it haphazardly up to smoking levels in a quick timeframe. It's not done to modify flavor whatsoever, rather it's meant to hydrate the tobacco in order to test the progress of an aging box. You moisten the outside wrapper and never the open foot. Let the cigar sit for a modest period (hour, perhaps?), smoke as you like. You would never do this or any other logical reason and only a very, very small percentage of smokers would ever have need to do this.

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BowhuntnHoosier
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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by BowhuntnHoosier » Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:06 am

kurtdesign1 wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:25 am
BowhuntnHoosier wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:08 am
I still remember the idea of putting a cigar under running water to improve the burn. Some very different ideas out there. Thanks Kip
This idea is actually rooted in validity, believe it or not. Basically though, it's never something that you or I would ever need to do. For those who truly store cigars long term (decades, not years) they typically adhere to a much lower humidity and temperature than what is generally regarded for good smoking conditions. Soaking or dipping a cigar in water is a way to aggressively moisten the tobacco to bring it haphazardly up to smoking levels in a quick timeframe. It's not done to modify flavor whatsoever, rather it's meant to hydrate the tobacco in order to test the progress of an aging box. You moisten the outside wrapper and never the open foot. Let the cigar sit for a modest period (hour, perhaps?), smoke as you like. You would never do this or any other logical reason and only a very, very small percentage of smokers would ever have need to do this.
Whatchu talkin about Willis...... If the cigars are stored at a very low humidity would'nt that cause the tobacco oils to dry up also? Causing basically a drastic change in flavor. So my question is. Why would someone do this to a cigar? If you want a lackluster flavored cigar then smoke a Macanudo or about 90% of the Cubans on the market today. Just a wonderin why... Thanks
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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by 815DC » Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:25 pm

Kip wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:24 pm
BowhuntnHoosier wrote:
Sun Jun 03, 2018 10:03 am
Washing pipe tobacco. Ok so what think you?
You see this?

20180603_145757.jpg
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That's me. Calling BS.

I had to check the published date of the video to see if it was April 1st. I'm being silly and don't want to harsh the buzz, but I do have a few issues with the idea....

1.) Nicotine itself is clear (it only turns yellow/brown when burned). The dark stuff he sees in his wash is other stuff - colorants, humectants, essential oils from the tobacco itself - (these oils are generally desirable, and give tobacco its character and flavor), and tannins. Frankly, Carter Hall is a mass market Middleton-produced pipe tobacco, not of the highest quality - and likely contains any number of things that wouldn't otherwise be present in higher quality blends. Think Black 'n' Mild versus My Father. You can get similarly colored water from almost any dried/fermented plant matter. Black tea isn't a nicotine champ, but drop some of that in a cup of water for 8 hours. Tannins give it this coloration.

2.) Why do this? Because you found a blend you love but can't handle the nicotine level of this particular tobacco? Then, smoke a little while and put your pipe down until later. I'm absolutely not buying his assertion that the flavor didn't change whatsoever. Refer to the pic above again. If there's no change in flavor after soaking out all that stuff in the tobacco, either a.) his palate is toast and he can't tell the difference, b.) he's lying, or c.) the tobacco had little to offer in the beginning. This kind of mindbending tea-making experiment wreaks havoc with tobacco. If you love a strong blend, smoke it in manageable doses....I believe it will no longer be what you fell in love with after being soaked in water for 8 hours.

3.) Unless you're going to smoke the end product rather quickly, you're absolutely begging for mold to grow on the tobacco. Even with distilled water. Once you bring it out of the solution and attempt to dry it, the race is on against time.

These things being said, the "tea" he made does have some use. It's a good foundation for betún, what cigar factories sometimes use to achieve uniform color in their leaf. Or, as a pesticide. Nicotine is a phenomenal pesticide, getting rid of all kinds of non-desirable bugs on your garden.

I'm all for experimentation with tobacco - sometimes to a ludicrous degree. But, I think I'll skip this one. I feel like he should have known better because the viewer who recommended the process to him asked for his name to be withheld. That reeks of someone who knew the idea was hokum, or was just pulling this guy's leg.

But hey, I remain a faithful adherent to "smoke what you like, and like what you smoke." If he digs it, more power to him.

The photo on this post made my day when I saw it. :lol:
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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by kurtdesign1 » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:29 am

BowhuntnHoosier wrote:
Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:06 am
Whatchu talkin about Willis...... If the cigars are stored at a very low humidity would'nt that cause the tobacco oils to dry up also? Causing basically a drastic change in flavor. So my question is. Why would someone do this to a cigar? If you want a lackluster flavored cigar then smoke a Macanudo or about 90% of the Cubans on the market today. Just a wonderin why... Thanks
Think about aging a cigar in terms of BBQ. I'm no expert on the culinary wizardry that is good 'Cue but I know that low and slow produces a better result. It is less aggressive and ensures more of the good stuff stays within the meat instead of being forced out by high heat. Cigar aging is the same thing. The more oxygen, exposure and higher temperature a cigar is exposed to will speed up the process but cost you in quality.
Storing a cigar at 55 and 55 in a fully sealed, original box will allow the cigar to more smoothly make it to its end game stage. The lower humidity and temperatures aren't so extreme to cause the cigars to "dry out" but also aren't high enough for what we would consider to be good smoking conditions. An unknown factor (quantity of involvement for this aspect) to me is whether the sealed container helps contribute to the inability for those essential oils to "evaporate". I know sealed packages are good for preventing oxygen exposure (which speeds the break down of the chain molecules within tobacco's chemical makeup) but I can't speak to the evaporation comment without more than a guess.
Hope this helps to a point.

As a side note BHH (I like that, Kip), look up Hong Kong cigar aging and you'll get much from this. HK is probably the world's largest current saturation of vintage cigar cellars. I've read some interesting articles and stories of cellaring cigars there. I'd have thought England but would guess that we're a generation or two late for that now.

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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by BowhuntnHoosier » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:57 am

Way too much science involved here for me. I completely believe low and slow is better. Going to be checking out the HK cigars later. Thanks Craig

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Re: OK new to pipes...tobaccos tried so far

Post by Kip » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:53 am

Since we're on the topic of wetting down cigars, I have a story about this. Once, many moons ago, I was sitting at House of Pipes in St. Pete when an older dude came in and bought a cigar. He sat down and promptly began to lick the cigar in its entirety. Entirety. Like, in a very sexually aggressive innuendo kinda way. Weirded us all the hell out. Anyway, he went on to explain he'd been in prison a long time and just got out. He wanted to smoke a cigar in celebration. Whatever. At that time I was on a first name basis with thousands of Florida convicts. That's not the point of the story.

I wasn't familiar with the idea of licking your cigar, but apparently it was something folks did back in the days before humidification was as finely controlled as today. Cigars were often just kept in shops on the counter, or other unhumidified places. This would have been before A/C was so prevalent, so humidity would have been whatever the ambient environment was I suppose. Anyway, cigars would often be quite dry when you bought them and folks would wet them down before lighting to try and do something like what Craig is describing. It's been almost 20 years ago, but that was news to me at the time. Never seen anyone else do it since.
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